How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

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How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Ludovic Rousseau
Hello,

The software forge alioth.debian.org will be replaced by something else (see "Alioth replacement sprint" [3]) in the next few months based on the pagure software [4].
The mailing lists hosted on alioth.debian.org will NOT be migrated. So I need to find a new place for the "Talks about MUSCLE" mailing list [1].

It is possible to ask the creation/move of the mailing list on lists.debian.org as explained in "Alioth: the future of mailing lists" [2].

But maybe someone has a better idea.
The list traffic is low in the last months/years (see "MUSCLE mailing list statistics for 2016" [5]) so maybe a mailing list is not the solution and something else could be used.

I am waiting for your suggestions.

Regards,

[1] https://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/pcsclite-muscle

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Re: [Non-DoD Source] How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Denniston, Todd A CIV NAVSURFWARCENDIV Crane, JXVS
Thanks for the heads up.

personally I would like to see a mailing list continue, as I find forums useless.
If others also want a mailing list to continue, please let us know what/if anything we need to do ourselves to help you move to it.

Thanks for the support you have been providing, and interesting reading from the rest of our list folks.

--
Even when this disclaimer is not here:
I am not a contracting officer. I do not have authority to make or modify the terms of any contract.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pcsclite-muscle [mailto:pcsclite-muscle-bounces+todd.denniston=[hidden email]]
> On Behalf Of Ludovic Rousseau
> Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 1:12 PM
> To: Talks about MUSCLE
> Subject: [Non-DoD Source] [Pcsclite-muscle] How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?
>
> Hello,
>
>
> The software forge alioth.debian.org will be replaced by something else (see "Alioth replacement sprint"
> [3]) in the next few months based on the pagure software [4].
>
> The mailing lists hosted on alioth.debian.org will NOT be migrated. So I need to find a new place for the
> "Talks about MUSCLE" mailing list [1].
>
> It is possible to ask the creation/move of the mailing list on lists.debian.org as explained in "Alioth: the
> future of mailing lists" [2].
>
>
> But maybe someone has a better idea.
> The list traffic is low in the last months/years (see "MUSCLE mailing list statistics for 2016" [5]) so maybe a
> mailing list is not the solution and something else could be used.
>
> I am waiting for your suggestions.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> [1] https://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/pcsclite-muscle
> [2] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2017/09/msg00004.html
>
> [3] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2017/06/msg00002.html
>
> [4] https://pagure.io/
>
>
> --
>
>  Dr. Ludovic Rousseau
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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

David Woodhouse
In reply to this post by Ludovic Rousseau
On Sun, 2017-10-01 at 19:11 +0200, Ludovic Rousseau wrote:

> Hello,
>
> The software forge alioth.debian.org will be replaced by something
> else (see "Alioth replacement sprint" [3]) in the next few months
> based on the pagure software [4].
> The mailing lists hosted on alioth.debian.org will NOT be migrated.
> So I need to find a new place for the "Talks about MUSCLE" mailing
> list [1].
>
> It is possible to ask the creation/move of the mailing list on
> lists.debian.org as explained in "Alioth: the future of mailing
> lists" [2].
>
> But maybe someone has a better idea.
> The list traffic is low in the last months/years (see "MUSCLE mailing
> list statistics for 2016" [5]) so maybe a mailing list is not the
> solution and something else could be used.
>
> I am waiting for your suggestions.
I could host it on lists.infradead.org if you want.
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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Ludovic Rousseau
Hello,

2017-10-03 19:43 GMT+02:00 David Woodhouse <[hidden email]>:
On Sun, 2017-10-01 at 19:11 +0200, Ludovic Rousseau wrote:
> Hello,
>
> The software forge alioth.debian.org will be replaced by something
> else (see "Alioth replacement sprint" [3]) in the next few months
> based on the pagure software [4].
> The mailing lists hosted on alioth.debian.org will NOT be migrated.
> So I need to find a new place for the "Talks about MUSCLE" mailing
> list [1].
>
> It is possible to ask the creation/move of the mailing list on
> lists.debian.org as explained in "Alioth: the future of mailing
> lists" [2].
>
> But maybe someone has a better idea.
> The list traffic is low in the last months/years (see "MUSCLE mailing
> list statistics for 2016" [5]) so maybe a mailing list is not the
> solution and something else could be used.
>
> I am waiting for your suggestions.

I could host it on lists.infradead.org if you want.

Thanks for the offer David.

I think it is a better hosting solution than lists.debian.org since the MUSCLE project is not related to Debian (except they are both free software projects).

Would it be possible to also host the list archives? It is possible to get .txt.gz files at http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pcsclite-muscle/

Regards,

PS: the web page http://lists.infradead.org/ mention the list fedora-ppc@... but this list does not exist any more :-)

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Frank Morgner-2
An other option which may be more visible and with new kinds of users would be to move the discussions to something like Stack Overflow...

2017-10-04 14:40 GMT+02:00 Ludovic Rousseau <[hidden email]>:
Hello,

2017-10-03 19:43 GMT+02:00 David Woodhouse <[hidden email]>:
On Sun, 2017-10-01 at 19:11 +0200, Ludovic Rousseau wrote:
> Hello,
>
> The software forge alioth.debian.org will be replaced by something
> else (see "Alioth replacement sprint" [3]) in the next few months
> based on the pagure software [4].
> The mailing lists hosted on alioth.debian.org will NOT be migrated.
> So I need to find a new place for the "Talks about MUSCLE" mailing
> list [1].
>
> It is possible to ask the creation/move of the mailing list on
> lists.debian.org as explained in "Alioth: the future of mailing
> lists" [2].
>
> But maybe someone has a better idea.
> The list traffic is low in the last months/years (see "MUSCLE mailing
> list statistics for 2016" [5]) so maybe a mailing list is not the
> solution and something else could be used.
>
> I am waiting for your suggestions.

I could host it on lists.infradead.org if you want.

Thanks for the offer David.

I think it is a better hosting solution than lists.debian.org since the MUSCLE project is not related to Debian (except they are both free software projects).

Would it be possible to also host the list archives? It is possible to get .txt.gz files at http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pcsclite-muscle/

Regards,

PS: the web page http://lists.infradead.org/ mention the list fedora-ppc@... but this list does not exist any more :-)

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Ludovic Rousseau
Hello Frank,

2017-10-04 20:49 GMT+02:00 Frank Morgner <[hidden email]>:
An other option which may be more visible and with new kinds of users would be to move the discussions to something like Stack Overflow...


I am not a user of Stack Overflow. But any feedback is good.

Thanks for the proposal.

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Frank Morgner-2
My suggestion was to *replace* the mailing list *with* Stack Overflow. For example, Microsoft (https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/forums/) and Google (https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/guava) are using a special tag on Stack Overflow for giving feedback about some of their products. The tag "muscle" is still untaken; using an existing tag like "smartcard" would also be possible.

Regards, Frank.

2017-10-05 9:13 GMT+02:00 Ludovic Rousseau <[hidden email]>:
Hello Frank,

2017-10-04 20:49 GMT+02:00 Frank Morgner <[hidden email]>:
An other option which may be more visible and with new kinds of users would be to move the discussions to something like Stack Overflow...


I am not a user of Stack Overflow. But any feedback is good.

Thanks for the proposal.

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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http://lists.alioth.debian.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pcsclite-muscle


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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

David Woodhouse
On Thu, 2017-10-05 at 12:08 +0200, Frank Morgner wrote:
> My suggestion was to *replace* the mailing list *with* Stack
> Overflow.

Oh $DEITY please no :)

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Frank Morgner-2
So you want to stay in your ivory tower for some more decades? Just kidding! As said before, it's a matter of taste and would be a chance to get more visible and to attract some new contributors.

2017-10-05 12:23 GMT+02:00 David Woodhouse <[hidden email]>:
On Thu, 2017-10-05 at 12:08 +0200, Frank Morgner wrote:
> My suggestion was to *replace* the mailing list *with* Stack
> Overflow.

Oh $DEITY please no :)


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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Ludovic Rousseau
In reply to this post by Frank Morgner-2
2017-10-05 12:08 GMT+02:00 Frank Morgner <[hidden email]>:
My suggestion was to *replace* the mailing list *with* Stack Overflow. For example, Microsoft (https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/support/forums/) and Google (https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/guava) are using a special tag on Stack Overflow for giving feedback about some of their products. The tag "muscle" is still untaken; using an existing tag like "smartcard" would also be possible.

Like David, I do not want to replace a mailing list by stackoverflow.
I do not use stackoverflow to ask or answer questions.

I tried to add the "muscle" tag to my question but I need to have 1500 reputation points to create a new tag, and I only have 11 points. Feel free to create the "muscle" tag if you want.

So the current plan is to move the MUSCLE list to lists.infradead.org.
I will wait until end of next week to get more feedback and other ideas.

Bye,

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Maksim Ivanov
Just to put another idea forward, maybe also consider using FreeLists.org? They seem to serve hundreds (thousands?) of mailing lists currently, and have been around for more than 15 years. Having said that, I don't know whether there could be any pitfalls with hosting a mailing list with them.


Regards,
Maksim


On Thu, Oct 5, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Ludovic Rousseau <[hidden email]> wrote:

Like David, I do not want to replace a mailing list by stackoverflow.
I do not use stackoverflow to ask or answer questions.

I tried to add the "muscle" tag to my question but I need to have 1500 reputation points to create a new tag, and I only have 11 points. Feel free to create the "muscle" tag if you want.

So the current plan is to move the MUSCLE list to lists.infradead.org.
I will wait until end of next week to get more feedback and other ideas.

Bye,

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Martin Paljak-4

Mailing list is a good thing to keep the same way as SO and other "modern channels" are good to broaden the community and make it easier for the "web generation" to access. At the same time SO has its own set of problems, such as noise from extremly low quality/lazy questions, but luckily there is a voting mechanism. Either way maybe it is time to retire the historical keyword, "muscle" and use either more generic (smartcard etc) or more technically precise (ccid, pcsc(-lite) etc) components, when naming things?

Martin


On Thu, Oct 5, 2017, 18:53 Maksim Ivanov <[hidden email]> wrote:
Just to put another idea forward, maybe also consider using FreeLists.org? They seem to serve hundreds (thousands?) of mailing lists currently, and have been around for more than 15 years. Having said that, I don't know whether there could be any pitfalls with hosting a mailing list with them.


Regards,
Maksim


On Thu, Oct 5, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Ludovic Rousseau <[hidden email]> wrote:

Like David, I do not want to replace a mailing list by stackoverflow.
I do not use stackoverflow to ask or answer questions.

I tried to add the "muscle" tag to my question but I need to have 1500 reputation points to create a new tag, and I only have 11 points. Feel free to create the "muscle" tag if you want.

So the current plan is to move the MUSCLE list to lists.infradead.org.
I will wait until end of next week to get more feedback and other ideas.

Bye,

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau
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--

typos expected due to mobile device


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Re: How to replace/move the MUSCLE mailing list?

Ludovic Rousseau
Hello,

2017-10-06 10:24 GMT+02:00 Martin Paljak <[hidden email]>:

Mailing list is a good thing to keep the same way as SO and other "modern channels" are good to broaden the community and make it easier for the "web generation" to access. At the same time SO has its own set of problems, such as noise from extremly low quality/lazy questions, but luckily there is a voting mechanism. Either way maybe it is time to retire the historical keyword, "muscle" and use either more generic (smartcard etc) or more technically precise (ccid, pcsc(-lite) etc) components, when naming things?


I also think that a mailing list is a good thing. I am more used to emails than to web site support forums.

I accept David proposal to host the list at https://lists.infradead.org/. It is also a good point to have the service admin using the list. If the list has a problem David can have a look at the server logs :-)

I will keep you inform of the migration progress.
Thanks for your feedbacks

Bye

--
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau

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